Kadiff Kirwan is the embodiment of screen and stage wide-range aptitude having appeared in Fleabag, Chewing Gum, Black Mirror, and now back with Season 4 of spy drama Slow Horses on Apple TV. Openly gay, he has managed to escape typecasts whether its comedy or drama. A true treasure of talent, Kadiff made time to speak with this during his run of Katori Hall’s Pulitzer prize winning play The Hot Wing King at the National Theatre in London.
In this exclusive story, Kadiff is captured by David Reiss in pieces styled by Way Perry.
Hi Kadiff! Let’s start at the beginning. Where did you grow up and how would you describe your household?
I spent the early years of my life in the Caribbean on the island of Montserrat, I grew up there until I was 8 years old. A Volcano erupted on the island that was once dormant and it devastated the majority of the island its inhabitants and with Montserrat being a British Overseas Territory, we moved to the UK, to Lancashire, and I grew up in Preston from the age of 8. So, from the Caribbean to Preston was quite a change, quite a different set of circumstances- the sandy white beaches of the Caribbean to the local beaches of Blackpool.
I must admit, I didn’t know about Montserrat until I saw the beautiful documentary The Other Final. Looking at your youth in the UK, can you tell me what is your earliest memory related to the theater?
I would say my earliest memory of going to the theatre was when I was in secondary school, we went on a class trip to see Blood Brothers by Willy Russell and I just had the most incredible time, I thought it was just fantastic! Seeing working class people on stage was quite transformative. Another moment was when I was in sixth form, I saw Jonathan Harvey’s Beautiful Thing at the Bolton Octagon and it was around the time I was becoming aware of myself as a person, and that queer story just sparked something inside me. It’s one of the linchpins of my creativity I’d say; seeing that play and being exposed to something that beautiful so early on.
This summer you are in the Pulitzer prize winning play The Hot Wing King at the National Theatre. Tell us a bit about your character and how it is being back on stage?
I am currently at The National Theatre starring in The Hot Wing King by Katori Hall, I play the character of Cordell who is an amateur chef preparing for a Hot Wing festival in Memphis Tennessee with his partner and his friends. He is someone who has gone through a lot of finding himself – he was previously married to a woman with two children and became his queer self later in life. The play navigates all of these themes and all of these new feelings that he has with the backdrop being this wonderful cooking celebration with his friends. It’s a weekend that goes not quite as planned. I’m absolutely loving being back at The National Theatre, the last time I was here was about 10 year ago, I did a play called Home which was just fantastic. It’s where I met some of my closest friends that I still have to this day. It’s just brilliant to be back with such a beautiful piece of writing, to be working with such a great creative team and to be playing a black queer character on The National Theatre stage is something I won’t forget.
Who has been your most complicated character so far?
I’d say probably Cordell – he is someone that is going through so much! He has got all of these toxic traits, these things that he has built up within him, this armor he has created from when he was living a heterosexual life. But now he is having to unravel it all through exploring the themes of brotherhood, fatherhood and relationships in the play. He is someone that is quite irascible at times as he has so much going on and is not someone who can say how he really feels so it comes out in the most volatile of ways at times. Throughout the journey of the play he finds himself and he finds the words. It’s just so beautiful to see him be somewhat born again from the start to the end and has been one of the joys of my life playing this role.
You joined the cast of Slow Horses in season two playing the compelling character Marcus, giving a bit of comic relief. Does it affect your personal life in any way to play a married man, gambler, failed MI5 agent? I’m trying to imagine you hanging out at MI5 trying to research.
Yes, I joined Slow Horses in season two and playing Marcus continues to be one of the many joys in my life. He is someone who has such a completely different rhythm to myself as a person so seeing that on the page was just brilliant. His relationship in S2 with Louisa and now his relationship with Shirley, who is played brilliantly by Aimee-Ffion Edwards, we get to dive into the sort of workplace husband and wife but in a completely platonic way. I love that their dynamic is unlike what you’d expect from two MI5 spies. They’re quite nippy at each other and it’s just been a delight to play this role. Research wise, I didn’t quite get to hang out with any MI5 agents (sorry to disappoint) so I just trolled the internet for as much as I could find and also the source material, the books by Mick Herron, were a great lighthouse in finding my character.
How did you make the character your own? How much time did you have to prepare for the role?
just used my instincts from what was on the page and tried to give him as many layers as possible. He is someone who is a father of two but is an addict when it comes to gambling and is also incredibly proficient at his job. It was about trying to navigate all of those things in someone who doesn’t say much as he prefers to have his actions speak for him. I made him my own by just following my instincts and thankfully that has done my well so far, ha!
When you read the role of Marcus, were you attracted to the script or had you already seen Season 1 and were like “yes”?
No, I hadn’t actually seen season one as it wasn’t out at the time I got the role. It was all about taking a punt and going for it! We weren’t sure what the show was going to be yet. Yes, it’s a spy drama but it’s got so much more to it with regards to comedy and the workplace environment relationships, it’s so many genres morphed into one, so we just followed our instincts. Getting the job was great so it was an automatic yes from me!
I will watch anything with Gary Oldman, one of the best actors ever. I know nothing about him as a person except possible autobiographical elements in Nil by Mouth, did you learn anything from him on your shared craft? I know his character was a horrible monster of a boss, so did that filter off set too?
Working with Gary has been life-changing for me and am fortunate enough to call him a friend now. He has overflowing talent and is a brilliant person and is nothing like Jackson Lamb – he is definitely not a monster of a person off screen. He is the kindest, most generous open person and to have a legend of an actor like that on our show, setting the tone of being a great leading man, I love working and sharing scenes with him. I think he is one of the funniest people I know and he’s got the best stories – I won’t tell you them but he really does have the best stories. He’s a Gent! A true gent and I adore him.
I have to admit, it is sometimes difficult to interview actors whilst trying to separate their characters from their actual personalities. With that note, is it important that you identify with your character?
I do try to separate myself from characters, often you get cast in a role because there is something about yourself that you can lend to the character which will make it slightly easier. For me, Marcus isn’t like myself but there are pieces of myself that I put within him and it’s great to do that but no, he is not like me. I think it’s important to identify with my characters yes, I always try to find something about my character that I’m playing that I enjoy; so, Marcus for me, it’s his understated sense of humour and I try to identify with that and how he uses his humour to disarm situations. I’m not sure if that made any sense but that’s my answer, ha!
There has been a lot of discussion over the years on straight actors playing queer roles. If you have an opinion feel free to share, but what I really want to know is what type of roles are not being written that you would like to see more of?
Indeed, there has been a lot of discussion about straight actors playing queer roles. I personally don’t have an issue with straight actors playing queer roles, I would just love for everyone to be seen for the queer roles that are out there. Queer actors of course can draw from a wealth of personal knowledge and experience and add something to those roles but I think the problem potentially arises when they aren’t seen for those roles for various reasons. I feel it’s important that actors get to play a range of things. I wish there were more black queer roles taking the forefront of storytelling that aren’t just the ‘best friends’ or ‘side stories’, I’d love to see that! I’ve adored doing this play for that very reason, where it’s six black men on stage that all have equal stakes in a story. I’d love to continue to see more stories like that being told. I think everyone should be able to play everything but also everyone should be seen for everything with regards to the queer spectrum. I think it’s important that queer actors have access to queer roles just as much as they have access to straight roles and vice versa for straight actors to be able to play queer roles and play straight characters. I think if the pendulum swing was equal we wouldn’t need to have this conversation but I think things are getting better.
If you don’t mind, I’m going to fan girl a bit. You have worked with Michaela Coel on both Chewing Gum and the extraordinary I May Destroy You. Did you know her or her work previously? I have so many questions, but I will narrow it down to a simple: How was your experience working with Coel?
Michaela and I met at The National Theatre about ten years ago! We were playing best friends in a production of Home and it came to pass that we became great friends –sort of art imitating life, life imitating art. She is a dear friend and I adore working with her! Chewing Gum was one of the first TV jobs where I really got to throw myself into a character and to have the creator on set with you, as your friend, to be able to ask whatever questions you like was absolutely something that wasn’t lost on me. I understood how special it was to have that. I think she is a completely singular talent and is just amazing; as a creator, actor, director, writer and friend. I think the world is a far better place for having Michaela Coel in it.
Do you have a preference for projects or is it all about the script and production teams?
Yeah, it’s all about the story! Is the story something I want to be a part of is something I always ask myself when I read a script and if it’s something I feel I can give myself over to, then it’s a yes!
You were in the Nosedive episode of Black Mirror, perhaps one of the scariest as it appears it could happen today. What was it like to film that? Many people talk about how we are living in Black Mirror. What has been the most haunting or cautionary episode you have seen?
That was such a fun episode to film! Michaela was also in that episode. We shot it in Cape Town and working with Joe Wright was well, masterly, he is one of the best directors to come out of the UK! Working with Bryce Dallas Howard was fantastic, she was so kind and I had done very little TV at that point, I will forever remember her generosity and kindness. South Africa was a dream. I’ve been pretty fortunate when I think about all of these jobs that I’ve done so far. That episode, yes, it’s very much where we are going as a society. It’s crazy how on point it was with where we are going with the ratings systems of everything. I would say that is the most haunting episode I’ve seen and also just happened to be a part of it.
You are also under commission with BBC studio’s writing and developing your own comedy drama ‘Plan B’. Can you tell us a bit more about this? And are you planning to star in it?
It is a queer story. It is funny. It is dramatic. And is something I’ve wanted to write for a very long time. I will be starring in it and am just really excited to be exploring all the colours that I possibly can to make the story as vivid as possible. I’m very thrilled to be writing my own pilot!
At Fucking Young! We love fashion, so I have to ask, what was the worst trend you ever sported?
Crocs! I loathe them. They are not for me. Of course, I’m sure they’re comfortable though. I had to wear a pair when I was playing a doctor, Julian in This Is Going To Hurt for the BBC, and that was painful! Hideous things.
Lucky for you, Crocs have hit their tipping point and will now remain in the hospital or garden. With having to do so much press, and BAFTA red carpets of course, do you work with a stylist? How has your style evolved over the years?
My style has evolved by me getting to know myself more and by being more risky with things. I love recycling things and finding pieces in charity shops and vintage stores. I sometimes work with a stylist and I sometimes self-style. I adore clothing and getting to express how I’m feeling at that time with what I’m wearing, It’s really fun.
Any other exciting future projects you can speak about?
There is a really exciting job I finished this year that will be coming out early next year – it’s a RIOT! I literally can’t say anything about it other than its going to be incredibly fun and I think the public are going to really enjoy it. That’s all I can say! Thank you so much for these questions Fucking Young Magazine – you guys are dope!
Episode One of Slow Horses is available now on Apple TV +
The Hot Wing King runs at the National Theatre, South Bank, London until 14 September 2024
CREDITS:
Photographer: David Reiss
Grooming: Lauraine Bailey
Styling: Way Perry
Clothing: Average Boys Club, COS, JW Anderson, Labrum, Simone Rocha
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Publish date : 2024-09-06 19:00:00
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